Updating Tally Comp - Part 2 (Beastmen to Daemons)

Right, here are the first 4 armies with their updated Tally Comp. If you play any of these armies, please feel free to let me know what you think about how your list has been affected.

Beastmen

- Beastmen players start at a comp score of +5

-1 per Shaman or Great Shaman after the first, only if the Shard of the Herdstone is included
-1 per unit of Ungor Raiders after the 2nd
-1 per unit of Harpies
-1 per Tuskgor Chariot after the first 3

+1 for the first unit of 20+ Ungor Herds
+1 per unit of 5+ Minotaurs
+1 per unit of Centigors

+1 per unit of 8+ Razorgor
+1 per Giant
+1 per Jabberslythe
+1 per Cygor
+1 per Ghorgon
+1 Khazrak The One Eye
+1 Gorthor The Beastlord
+1 Malagor, The Dark Omen
+1 Taurox, The Brass Bull
+1 Moonclaw, Son of Moorslieb
+1 Ungrol Four-Horn
+1 Ghorros Warhoof

Commentary

Not a lot of change here. The most important bit was to remove the additional points that were available to Beastmen lists. I want the comp to be able to be used at a variety of points levels, and having a chunk of extra points as an option seemed a little over the top. Plus, we now have everyone starting on an even footing - in terms of points anyway! They now get a +5 Comp score to each Beastmen list, and that helps to compensate for how expensive their models are.

Bretonnia

-1 per Virtue of Heroism
-1 if you have Silver Mirror and Dispel Scroll
-1 if Crown of Command is on a Damsel or Prophetess, in addition to generic comp
-1 per Virtue of the Impetuous Knight
-1 per Trebuchet after the first.

-1 per Bretonnian Lord or Paladin after the 6th

+1 per Hippogriff, in addition to generic comp
+1 per Lord/Paladin on foot, +2 if the General is on foot
+1 for the first unit of 30+ Men-at-Arms
+1 for the first unit of Peasant Bowmen
+1 per unit of Mounted Yeomen
+1 per unit of Questing Knights over 5 models
+2 Grail Reliquae
+3 if you only have 1 unit of Knights in the army, reduced to +1 if you also take Pegasus Knights
+1 Louen Leoncouer
+1 The Fey Enchantress
+1 The Green Knight

Commentary

The major change here is to take into account the End Times rules, so if you take a large number of characters then there is a comp penalty. We have also reduced the comp on Trebuchets to only the second one giving a penalty.

Chaos Dwarfs

-2 per K’daai Destroyer
-1 Chalice of Blood and Darkness
-1 per Sorcerer Prophet on Hashut
-1 per Death Shrieker Rocket
-1 per Magma Cannon
-1 per Hellcannon
-1 per Bull Centaur Taur’uk
-1 per war machine after the 4th (note that the Hellcannon counts for this, and this is on top of the individual scores per war machine)
+1 for the first unit of Chaos Dwarfs armed with Fireglaves
+1 per unit of Chaos Dwarf Ironsworn
+1 per unit of K’daai Fireborn
+1 per Dreadquake Mortar

+1 for the first Iron Daemon
+1 per Lammasu

Commentary

Again, as it is apparently a legal requirement, #NotARealArmy. ;-) We removed the line giving a bonus for Hobgoblins, as they seem to be in most competitive Chaos Dwarf lists anyway and don't need the bonus. The bonus for Iron Daemons was also reduced to +1 for the first only, rather than the first 2.

Daemons of Chaos

- Daemons of Chaos armies start at a comp score of -2, to take into account the army wide Special Rules and the Reign of Chaos table.

- Mono God Armies. If your army consists solely of Daemons of a single Chaos God, you may apply the below bonuses:
+1 if your army consists solely of Daemons of Nurgle
+1 if your army consists solely of Daemons of Tzeentch – also you may ignore the penalty for multiple Tzeentch casters
+2 if your army consists solely of Daemons of Slaanesh
+2 if your army consists solely of Daemons of Khorne - also you may halve the penalty for having 2 Skull Cannons

-3 Epidemius
-8 Kairos Fateweaver
-1 Blue Scribes
-2 Be'Lakor
-1 per Exalted Gift
-1 per Herald of Nurgle in the army more than units of 20+ Plaguebearers in the army
-1 per Exalted Flamer, increasing to -2 for each Exalted Flamer after the 2nd
-1 per caster using the Lore of Tzeentch after the 2nd
-1 per unit of Beasts of Nurgle
-1 per Beast of Nurgle model after the 5th
-1 per Plague Drone unit
-1 if you have 1 Skull Cannon of Khorne, -4 if you have 2 Skull Cannons

+1 per Daemon Prince
+1 per Keeper of Secrets
+1 per Blood Throne of Khorne
+1 for the first unit of Daemonettes
+1 for the first unit of Bloodletters
+1 per Seeker Chariot of Slaanesh or Hellflayer of Slaanesh after the 1st
+1 per Burning Chariot of Tzeentch
+1 per unit of 4 or more Bloodcrushers
+1 per Exalted Chariot of Slaanesh
+1 Skarbrand
+1 Ku'Gath Plaguefather

Commentary

Here is where a lot of the major changes took place. Daemons are so good, they are very difficult to comp correctly. The immediate thing to note is a generic -2 to the whole army. This is mainly to account for the Reign of Chaos, but also stops us over comping units that don't really need it because they have a Ward Save and ItP etc.

In terms of other changes, Kairos has now been comped to a major level. He's just that good, especially in the End Times where you can have plenty of other characters too. There is also a penalty for Exalted Gifts, this helps mitigate anyone who wants to take multiple Greater Daemons, and also hits the Eternal Blade (which deserves it!). 

I think people may get a little annoyed about the Nurgle Herald comp, but it seems that the netlist nowadays has a single unit of Plaguebearers with two Heralds, and if it is that common it must also be rather effective. An extra -1 to that is not out of the question.

You may be thinking here that Daemons can't get positive scores, and you'd be wrong. Admittedly, it's quite hard if you want to take a lot of the good stuff. However, with a little bit of creative list building you can quite easily get into the low positives, and a Mono-Slaanesh list can score major bonus points!

Please let me know what you think. You know where you can get hold of me - here, TWF or Twitter are the best bets. Also, make sure you come back tomorrow for the next installment, Dark Elves to High Elves!

Updating Tally Comp - Part 1

Hello again!

I have been rather busy over the last few weeks - I've been getting my army ready for the Blood and Glory event in a couple of weeks (that may be worth a post of it's own later!) and I've been looking at the Tally Comp pack used at Raze and Ruin. I always planned to update this after the event, to try and keep it as an evolving document. However, with the release of the End Times series of books, and the expansion of the character percentages to 50% it needed a lot more work to update this than I thought!

I have also volunteered to help run the Student Nationals Warhammer event next March, and have suggested that they use the Tally Comp to help mitigate any extremes. I asked Jacob Corteen, who placed 2nd at Raze and who was a great help in writing the original pack to assist me with this, and we have tried to go through each army to see what can be changed in light of the changes to the game.

The plan with this blog post is to do a very similar thing to what I did for the original release of the comp - I will cover the Generic Comp in this post, and then I will release 4 armies at a time, starting this evening, in alphabetical order. Unfortunately we haven't been able to get to the two new Legion lists, as we just don't have enough experience with or against them to see what needs comp. I will also try and add some commentary where I can to explain some of the changes. So, with no further ado, here is the updated Generic comp!

Generic Composition Rules

• The following generic magic items will attract composition points if taken in your army:

-1 for the Crown of Command

-1 for the Standard of Discipline

-3 for Fozzrik’s Folding Fortress

+2 for the Arabyan Carpet

+2 for the Wizarding Hat

+1 for Shivejir’s Hex Scroll

•  The following bonuses apply if the circumstances are met:

+1 if your army does not include an item that automatically dispels a spell (Such as the Dispel Scroll or the Cube of Darkness. This does not apply to Daemons of Chaos)

+2 if your army includes a race-specific magic item that costs 60 points or more (note that Exalted Gifts from the Daemons of Chaos army book and Runic Items from the Dwarfs army book do not count, though Dwarf Ancestral Heirlooms do count)

+2 if your army includes no magic users, spells or bound items (This does not apply to Dwarfs)

• Units (not characters or single models) that cost over a certain points value will attract penalties as per the below list:

-1 per unit that costs between 450 and 599 points inclusive

-3 per unit that costs between 600 and 749 points inclusive

-5 per unit that costs 750 points or more

(These penalties are waived if a unit attracts a positive modifier)

• In addition, certain choices available to many armies have bonuses or penalties attached as follows:

+1 for a non-spellcaster character mounted on a Monster

+1 per character mounted on a Chariot

-1 per character who knows 3 or more spells from the Lore of Death or the Lore of Life.  (Special Characters are exempt from this penalty.)

-1 per spellcaster who knows spells from the Lore of Light after the second

Commentary

The Generic Comp section seemed rather straight-forward from the lists at Raze and Ruin. There were some things that caused problems, but rather than change the whole of the Generic Comp section, we have dealt with them in the individual army sections.

What we did change was the addition of the Hex Scroll. This is a very characterful item from the Rulebook, and is rather expensive for the likelihood it has of working. We felt that encouraging people to take this item is on a similar line to promoting the Wizarding Hat or Arabyan Carpet - characterful items that make the game more fun!

OK, so that's it for the Generic Comp. Later on this evening, there will be another post detailing the first of the updated armies - Beastmen to Daemons. If you have any comments on this, please feel free to contact me using the form below, or on TWF or through Twitter. I look forward to seeing what you think!